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June 7, 2016 at 11:37 am #101530JulianCohenParticipant
I am now at the stage where I am working on my first MR system so I decided it was a good time to start a journal.
I am testing the Connors/Alvarez RSI system mainly to experiment with Monte Carlo routines and stress testing. I coded up the system with the following rules:
Enter
C > MA(200)
VIX 5% or more above its 10day MA.
2 day RSI < 5
Enter on limit order .25ATR(10) below low on next dayExits
Exit if VIX 5% or more below 10day MA
Close higher than previous day
RSI(2) > 65, 70 or 75
Exit open next dayBacktesting on Russell Historical 1000, 1/1/2000 to 2/6/2016, Open Int, Ave Vol Filter 500K over 7 days, RSI exit > 65, position size 20 / 5%
Base test is as follows:
Full System – stretch .2ATR
Total trades 13,208
Win% 63.865
Ave P/L% 0.46%
Profit Factor 1.33
CAGR 19.70%
MDD -21.28%
MAR 0.93
Ave Winning bars held 2.83
Ave Losing bars held 4.09I tried with a wider stretch…
Full System – stretch .8ATR
Total trades 6,791
Win% 65.25%
Ave P/L% 1.02%
Profit Factor 1.65
CAGR 22.80%
MDD -14.21%
MAR 1.61
Ave Winning bars held 3.18
Ave Losing bars held 4.29Better CAGR and MDD…less trades too
Then I tried experimenting with stripping back the entries and exits. I kept the C > MA(200) to ensure a bullish market…
C>MA(200) and RSI entry and RSI exit only stretch .8ATR
Total trades 5,665
Win% 68.68%
Ave P/L% 1.30%
Profit Factor 1.51
CAGR 24.09%
MDD -20.98%
MAR 1.15
Ave Winning bars held 5.55
Ave Losing bars held 10.28Is it a better result? Swings and roundabouts really….
I tried with an RSI entry and a close on higher high exit
C>MA(200), RSI entry, higher close exit, .8ATR stretch
Total trades 7,489
Win% 65.83%
Ave P/L% 1.01%
Profit Factor 1.55
CAGR 25.26%
MDD -16.67%
MAR 1.52
Ave Winning bars held 3.27
Ave Losing bars held 4.56That looks pretty good.
I tried with the VIX filter back on the entry and the simple higher close on the exit
C>MA(200), RSI and VIX Filter entry, higher close exit, .8ATR stretch
Total trades 6,759
Win% 66.05%
Ave P/L% 1.04%
Profit Factor 1.61
CAGR 23.24%
MDD -16.09%
MAR 1.44
Ave Winning bars held 3.26
Ave Losing bars held 4.57Also very good. One major problem with all of them though is that in the last five or six years the system stinks. I’m sure most of you reading this have discovered the same kind of thing. In theory this is a good system and the idea of the VIX filter I like as it tries to put you in the market when the uncertainty is higher. I tried it with the VIX filter set at 10% and the results are better, but the last five years still stink. As an exercise this was very constructive for me.
Time to consider different options. I believe a few of you are using profit targets so I might experiment a little with that.
June 7, 2016 at 9:54 pm #104141Nick RadgeKeymasterA metric that I find very useful and rarely used is Profit Factor. Profit Factor measures the difficulty to trade the strategy. Anything under 1.5 in my view is probably a very difficult ask for most traders.
June 7, 2016 at 11:22 pm #104306LeeDanelloParticipantWhat about payoff ratio. Would have thought that you should be trying to aim greater than 1.0
June 8, 2016 at 1:16 am #104307TrentRothallParticipantNick Radge wrote:A metric that I find very useful and rarely used is Profit Factor. Profit Factor measures the difficulty to trade the strategy. Anything under 1.5 in my view is probably a very difficult ask for most traders.Should profit factor be calculated on a non compounding basis to be accurate?
June 8, 2016 at 5:18 am #104142Nick RadgeKeymasterQuote:Should profit factor be calculated on a non compounding basis to be accurate?Shouldn’t matter.
June 8, 2016 at 5:43 am #104309JulianCohenParticipantThe Ave P/L% and the payoff ratio are the same thing…is that correct?
June 8, 2016 at 7:10 am #104143JulianCohenParticipantI did some more testing today. I set up to try and achieve a better CAGR over the last few years so I only tested from 1/1/2010 to 2/1/2016. If this looks promising I will test back over the other periods
Entry
C>MA(C,200)
RSI(2) > 10Exit if C>MA(C,10)
Total trades 1390
Win% 66.47%
Ave P/L% 0.90%
Profit Factor 1.41
Payoff Ratio W/L Ratio 0.71
CAGR 9.4%
MDD -20.46%
MAR 0.46
Ave Winning bars held 9.85
Ave Losing bars held 20.48It looks like the losing trades are holding for a longer period so I experimented with cutting trades after 8 bars
Total trades 2956
Win% 62.04%
Ave P/L% 0.69%
Profit Factor 1.37
Payoff Ratio W/L Ratio 0.84
CAGR 16.29%
MDD -20.91
MAR 0.78
Ave Winning bars held 6.78
Ave Losing bars held 8.94Change price filter to $1 to $100
Total trades 2990
Win% 61.61%
Ave P/L% 0.73%
Profit Factor 1.38
Payoff Ratio W/L Ratio 0.86
CAGR 17.48%
MDD -17.24%
MAR 1.01
Ave Winning bars held 6.76
Ave Losing bars held 8.93
Only 2015 was a single digit returnSame test from 1/1/2000 to 2/6/2016
Total trades 8,024
Win% 62.31%
Ave P/L% 1.14%
Profit Factor 1.43
Payoff Ratio W/L Ratio 0.87
CAGR 30.32%
MDD -30.03%
MAR 1.01
Ave Winning bars held 6.69
Ave Losing bars held 8.96Things are looking better…but my question is am I now venturing into curve fitting territory?
June 8, 2016 at 7:28 am #104144Nick RadgeKeymasterQuote:Things are looking better…but my question is am I now venturing into curve fitting territory?Nope. You still have a bucket load of sample trades.
June 9, 2016 at 10:32 am #104145JulianCohenParticipantI learned something today. ALWAYS check the charts after writing a new system that has a piece of code you haven’t used before, to make sure it is doing the right thing, before using it to create three other systems and doing 200 tests.
June 9, 2016 at 9:26 pm #104146Nick RadgeKeymasterYep – Rule Validation
June 14, 2016 at 6:34 am #104147JulianCohenParticipantI couldn’t help noticing in the Collaboration forum that Said’s latest system had Exit one profitable close. For those of you that have been using profit targets can you tell me if you are using a stop loss as well?
June 14, 2016 at 7:49 am #104148TrentRothallParticipantHi Julian
Its not so much a profit target i dont think, it is just if todays close is greater than yesterdays.
exit = c > ref(c,-1)
Nick wrote about it in his second income series!
Also i am not using a stop loss at all just a time based exit
June 14, 2016 at 9:18 am #104149ScottMcNabMemberI had a stop loss when I was using this type of exit….more to allow me to trade it psychologically than perhaps any statistical benefit
June 14, 2016 at 10:12 am #104335SaidBitarMemberJulian Cohen wrote:I couldn’t help noticing in the Collaboration forum that Said’s latest system had Exit one profitable close. For those of you that have been using profit targets can you tell me if you are using a stop loss as well?if you want to use profit target then using stop loss or not depends on the target. If the profit target is fixed then i think it is better to use a stop loss, if the profit target is changing then there is no need to use stop loss. Backtesting will show if it is needed or not.
Fixed profit target such as x$ from the entry or a fixed value that does not change with every bar while variable profit target is a one that changes the value with a very bar
June 28, 2016 at 2:50 am #104150TrentRothallParticipantHi Julian
I just listened to the group call, check out this page on my journal https://edu.thechartist.com.au/Forum/progress-journal/35-trents-weekly-journal.html?start=30 it talks about the trades i take when the index is down.
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